War Years Tactics

[*******]

It was common in those days for a unit, engine or truck to go in by themselves waiting help. Two incidents still stand out in my mind, memory. Working 9x6 in 50 engine. The truck, 19, had BI. For some of those days when the truck had BI we would swap rigs and the truck would do BI with the engine, officer, mpo and members. That day, think it was 1970, was the day they were opening up the tin house on Boston and 169 for E85/L59. All the brass was there and the companies were OOS for the ceremony. About 1000 we (19) get a 1st due box. We respond. On the box would be 50,85,19,59,B27. 85 and 59 are not sent, nor replaced. A distant Battalion is sent for the 27th. That day 19 was doing schools on BI. We respond pull up and we have a good fire 3rd floor tenement. There is a woman standing in front of the building screaming that her baby was in the fire apartment. I give an "urgent", no response back. Another "urgent" and still no response back. Get off the rig and go up the stairs. The fire is at the apartment door. We try and push it back with the can but is like pissing on a bonfire. I only get in about 10 feet and was able to do a quick search in a bathroom first room on the right. Had to be 10 minutes after the box when 19 finally has a line on the landing. We switch and take the line in with 19 now operating as a truck. Back room we find the baby's body. He looked like a small ash with bumps for arms and legs. Was told that he had turned 1 years old the day before. Had a lot of fires those days, will never forget this one or the little guy. Another 9x6 few years later working in 82 we come out of a building and the dispatcher asks if we are available. I say yes and he gives us an address and box. We go. 31 and the 27 are still in the building. Dispatcher tells the 17th Battalion that he has 1 and 1, 82 and 17 truck coming from below. Pull up and we have an H with a fire 3rd floor. People in front of the building tell me that a woman and 3 kids are in the apartment. I give an urgent, it is answered. Go up the stairs, fire is out into the hallway. I can hear a woman screaming on the floor above. I yell down to Patty O'Neill to go up and get the woman. Again I only get in a few feet, nothing. Fire now on the floor above. Patty rescues a woman and 3 kids, brings them down. We find out that this is the woman whose apartment was on fire. She ran up to her neighbors apartment instead of downstairs. Neighbor was gone but they were trapped. Fire went to a 2nd. I wrote Patty up and he got a Class 3 and a medal that year, well deserved.

 

[mikeindabronx]

Chief...great tails from days gone by.

 

[guitarman314]

This is becoming my favorite place on this site. Because I buffed during that period, it really brings back so many memories while giving me a more advance course on all the "how's & why's" going on back then.

 

[Bronx72]

Thanks for that "*******".  (You might be a Newbie on this website, but you're a Hero to all of us listening).
A couple of historical dates for you, if I may....
E85 and TCU712 moved into the Tin House on 7/8/1971.  The TCU was still part time.  It then became L59 on 11/24/1972, two days after E88-2 was disbanded to form E72, and Sq 1 moved out of Manhattan into the Bronx with E46 and L27 on E 176 St.

 

[johnd248]

I don't think SQ 1 was ever in Manhattan or the Bronx.

 

[svd385]

SQUAD 1 MANHATTAN
ORG. 180 W. 137th St. At E-59 (Apr. 16, 1955)
NQTRS. 111 W. 133rd St. W/ E-59 (Nov. 1, 1962)
SQUAD 1 BRONX
RELOC. 451 E. 176th St. At L-58 (Nov. 22, 1972)
RELOC. 925 E. Tremont St. At E-45 (Oct. 31, 1975)
DISB. (May 1, 1976)
SQUAD 1 BROOKLYN
REORG. 786 Union St. FQ E-269 (Dec. 1, 1977)
RELOC. 395 4th Ave. At E-239 (Aug. 26, 2003)
RQTRS. 786 Union St. W/ TRV (Dec. 26, 2004)

 

[johnd248]

Thanks; I stand corrected.

 

[811]

At Engine 59 with converted 1940 Mack Hose Wagon

 

[Bronx72]

For those who may have dispatched during these days of second sections, TCU's, and Adaptive Response, this issue of limited response, often due to high call volume, must have been challenging.  How deep into a run card would you go to try to satisfy a response requirement (e.g. two and two required and the closest trucks available are those on the 3rd alarm and 5th alarm)?
Or would you ask closer trucks if they were available?

 

[Bronx72]

Does anyone have thoughts or can share experiences about going to the floor above the fire to work?  I'm  interested how you could tolerate conditions while doing a search or looking for fire extension and what you would do if no hose line was there with you.

 

[woodhavenman]

The floor above was something else again.  My first few jobs were first due and/or second due at top floor jobs, which meant going to the roof.  I remember telling my lifelong friend 68jk09 that you could get a breath of air by putting your nose right on the floor.  He said, wait until you are on the floor above.  It will do you no good, there is no air there.  He was right, I soon found out.  There were two breaths inside your turnout coat and that was it.  First order of business was to remind the engine co. and 1st due ladder that we were going above.  Then force the door as quickly as possible to get inside and off the landing which was the worst place to be once the door to the fire apt. was open and before the bulkhead door open. And before the skylight came crashing down.  The roofman would get the door first, then one pane of the skylight as a warning that in a few seconds there would be a shower of glass.  Once inside, get into the first room, take glass, get a breath out the window, quick search, then next room etc.  We were looking for victims and fire extension.  We could help out the companies below by using a 6' hook to take out the shaft windows on the fire floor.  In a RR flat the OVM would take glass in the rear and the chauf in front, sometimes with the aerial.  You tried your best not to cough because if you coughed once you could not stop.  Then we had a young lieut. assigned to us from Rescue 1.  He proposed that that when we were second due the forcible entry team would put on masks.  He also proposed taking the masks out of the boxes and into the jump seats so they could be quickly donned.  That part was nixed by the Batt. who did not want the masks damaged.  But sanity prevailed and we used masks when second due.  Now we could walk in instead of crawl, take glass not for air but for visibility, make a better search, and not have a pounding carbon monoxide headache for the next few hours.  Those were the days, my friend; we thought they'd never end...

 

[Ghetto Gladiator]

Woodhavenman!!  It don't get any better than that, exciting post...lol

 

[mikeindabronx]

Woodhavenman...Thanks

 

[Bronx72]

Very interesting - thank you.
I would say that conditions wouldn't improve up there until  a. more venting was done, b. the fire below was knocked down.  If the search proved negative, how would you deal with possible extension?  Could you hear it in the walls?  Would you wait for a charged line before opening up walls?

 

[mack]

Thanks Woodhavenman. Great post.

 

[woodhavenman]

Thanks for the compliments guys;  I am glad you enjoyed my post.  Everyone who worked those years  has a thousand stories to tell.  Some of the brothers have written books that can be found in the FDNY Library or from various vendors.  It's good to get that info in print for future firefighters to study and enjoy.  To finish up on my post:  Once we got handie talkies it was easier for  the officer to  notify BC that primary search was complete.  Then a more thorought search was made, checking closets, under beds etc.  It was routine at a good job to open the baseboards with a halligan tool to check for extension.  Any hot spot on a wall was opened.  If fire was found we waited for a charged line and then opened the wall and pulled the ceiling.  Sometimes you could hear the fire in the walls upon first entering and a second line would be called for.  We disregarded  the fire; nothing to do, could not open it without a line so we would continue to search.  Disregard is not the correct word.  We had to be aware of it since we were passing it without a line and had to realize that it could break out before the second line was charged.  Hope this helps to describe operations on the floor above.  I look forward to reading future posts at this site.

 

[Bronx72]

Just terrific...all of it.  If anyone else has situations or topics that might spark a story from one of our veterans, by all means, have at it!

 

[Ghetto Gladiator]

It was always challenging to look for extension,  around radiator pipes, bathroom pipes,  holes in hot walls were best at the floor so as not to draw fire. If a line was needed you would yell down the stairs or out a front window. Breaking windows as you went and the occasional mirror, seeing reflected light thinking it was daylight, very disappointing, zero visibility. I always enjoyed feeling the vibration in the floor from the eng. co. below hitting the ceiling. It was kinda eerie, you were in there alone quite often and sound was very muffled but as a truckie ya did stay dry.     

 

[Bronx72]

This might be a bit off the subject, but does anyone have any "THIRD ALARMER" newsletters?  They published during the 60's and 70's.  I have a few copies (borrowed) and they have very detailed greater alarm fire information.  Thanks.

 

[fdny1075k]

Thought I'd try and bring this thread back if anyone has any info to add to it. Very interesting reading. A time before bunker gear, radios, F.A.S.T., and sometimes without SCBA. Great stuff guys, thanks for posting.