company number

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Long time ago I had my question answered whether there is some system in company numbers. There isn't.
Don't know why it took me so long but the following question recently came up:

When a new company is being established, how will the company number be determined.
I cannot imagine it's just random...
 
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In NYC (unfortunately) i do not think there will be any new Companies opened right now but i would say if there were the number would be one available w/the same amount of numbers as the surrounding Units ....for example if in Manhattan or the BX single or double digits ....the other 3 boros ...triple digits...... other than that no particular reason.
 
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The last time they organized a new company they used the next higher number in the sequence, to wit engine 168 on SI.
 
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When they organized the last LAD in 1998 they used 133 which was out of sequence & had actually been scheduled many many years ago to be in the old qtrs of ENG*206 on Metropolitan Ave when the house was built.....so really it can go either way....i always thought 141 might be a number used.
 
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IRISH said:
Can they not just re-open a Disbanded Co??
Disbanded company numbers brought back: E47, L18, L36 were 1st in the Bx. then reorganized in Manhattan; E38, E43*, E66*, E72, E85*, E89 & L39 and Batt. 3 were first in Manhattan then reorganized in Bx. (*) denotes former Marine engine in Manhattan later reorganized as a Bronx land engine. Also Brooklyn co's. that were reorganized years later in Queens: E251 & E326
 

811

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And don't forget E232, a Brooklyn boat, disbanded then reorganized as a land company, then disbanded.
 
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Seems to be random now anyway.
I guess long time ago units simply started like one, then two, three etc. and later possible due to consolidating regions they lost track of company numbers and thought... what ever :)

Thanks for your replies !
 
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The FDNY's numbering system can seem confusing.

The New York City Fire Department currently runs with 198 Engine Companies, 143 Truck Companies, 5 Rescue Companies, and 7 Squad Companies spread out in 214 Firehouses located across the city.

For Engines, numbers starting from 1 to 97 are on Manhattan and in the Bronx. Engines numbering from 98 to 150 were never organized. From there, Engine's 151 to 168 are on Staten Island, and from there Engine's 201 to 333 are Brooklyn and Queens. Engines numbering 169 to 200 were also never organized. The reason for missing numbers within the Boros is due to companies disbanding over the years. For example, Engine 2 used to be located in Midtown Manhattan. It is now disbanded and Rescue 1 is now located at Engine 2's former quarters.

For Ladders, 1 to 61 are on Manhattan and in the Bronx. Ladder 57 and Ladder 60 were never organized. Ladder's 62 to 75 were never organized. Ladder's 76 to 87 are on Staten Island. Ladder's 88 to 100 were also never organized. From there, Ladder's 101 to 176 are in Brooklyn and Queens. There was a Ladder 193 at one time stationed in Brooklyn from 1966 to 1968 at the quarters of Ladder 103. Again, like with the Engines, any missing numbers within those Boros are due to companies disbanding.

For Rescues, Rescue 1 is Manhattan below 125th Street, Rescue 2 has Brooklyn, Rescue 3 the Bronx and Manhattan above 125th Street, Rescue 4 has Queens, and Rescue 5 has Staten Island. Rescue 6 was placed into service for a short time, I believe, at Ladder 20's quarters in Lower Manhattan, but is only used now during special events. Rescue 7 is a Reserve Rescue and is not an active company. For Squads, Squad 1 is the Western half of Brooklyn and Staten Island, Squad 18 is Lower Manhattan, Squad 41 is the Western Bronx and Upper Manhattan, Squad 61 is the Eastern Bronx, Squad 252 is Eastern Brooklyn, and Squad's 270 and 288 are in Queens. For Marine Units, Marine 1 is located on Manhattan along the Hudson River, Marine 6 in Brooklyn along the East River, and Marine 9 on Staten Island in the Harbor.

Some companies and their designations were disbanded, then brought back.

Also, at one time, Brooklyn was it's own city with it's own fire department. Thus, the old BFD number designations were changed to the 200 and 100 series after the FDNY expanded into Brooklyn following Brooklyn's merger with Manhattan in the late 1890's.

I believe part of the reason why some company numbers were never organized was because the department anticipated the creation of new companies during it's phases of growth and expansion, thus some number designations may have been held in reserves for just that purpose.
 
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fdny1075k said:
The FDNY's numbering system can seem confusing.

The New York City Fire Department currently runs with 198 Engine Companies, 143 Truck Companies, 5 Rescue Companies, and 7 Squad Companies spread out in 214 Firehouses located across the city.

For Engines, numbers starting from 1 to 97 are on Manhattan and in the Bronx. Engines numbering from 98 to 150 were never organized. From there, Engine's 151 to 168 are on Staten Island, and from there Engine's 201 to 333 are Brooklyn and Queens. Engines numbering 169 to 200 were also never organized. The reason for missing numbers within the Boros is due to companies disbanding over the years. For example, Engine 2 used to be located in Midtown Manhattan. It is now disbanded and Rescue 1 is now located at Engine 2's former quarters.

For Ladders, 1 to 61 are on Manhattan and in the Bronx. Ladder 57 and Ladder 60 were never organized. Ladder's 62 to 75 were never organized. Ladder's 76 to 87 are on Staten Island. Ladder's 88 to 100 were also never organized. From there, Ladder's 101 to 176 are in Brooklyn and Queens. There was a Ladder 193 at one time stationed in Brooklyn from 1966 to 1968 at the quarters of Ladder 103. Again, like with the Engines, any missing numbers within those Boros are due to companies disbanding.

For Rescues, Rescue 1 is Manhattan below 125th Street, Rescue 2 has Brooklyn, Rescue 3 the Bronx and Manhattan above 125th Street, Rescue 4 has Queens, and Rescue 5 has Staten Island. Rescue 6 was placed into service for a short time, I believe, at Ladder 20's quarters in Lower Manhattan, but is only used now during special events. Rescue 7 is a Reserve Rescue and is not an active company. For Squads, Squad 1 is the Western half of Brooklyn and Staten Island, Squad 18 is Lower Manhattan, Squad 41 is the Western Bronx and Upper Manhattan, Squad 61 is the Eastern Bronx, Squad 252 is Eastern Brooklyn, and Squad's 270 and 288 are in Queens. For Marine Units, Marine 1 is located on Manhattan along the Hudson River, Marine 6 in Brooklyn along the East River, and Marine 9 on Staten Island in the Harbor.

Some companies and their designations were disbanded, then brought back.

Also, at one time, Brooklyn was it's own city with it's own fire department. Thus, the old BFD number designations were changed to the 200 and 100 series after the FDNY expanded into Brooklyn following Brooklyn's merger with Manhattan in the late 1890's.

I believe part of the reason why some company numbers were never organized was because the department anticipated the creation of new companies during it's phases of growth and expansion, thus some number designations may have been held in reserves for just that purpose.

  "fdny1075", that was an education for me. Alot of detail in there that I have never really given much thought to.

  I just want to say however that I believe Rescue 5 also covers parts of lower Brooklyn around Coney Island etc.
 

mack

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Originally, Brooklyn Fire Dept numbers were maintained when Brooklyn became part of NYC in 1898.  They were  re-numbered twice - in 1899 to prevent confusion with Manhattan companies numbered the same, and then in 1913, after the city had grown and FDNY formed companies in the Bronx, Queens and SI.. 

In 1899, engine companies in Brooklyn were renumbered with a 100 series number and hook and ladders were renumbered in the 50s.  Engine 1 became Engine 201 and  Ladder 8 in Brooklyn became Ladder 58 in 1899.

In 1913, companies were renumbered in Brooklyn and SI.  Engine 101 in Brooklyn became Engine 201 and Ladder 58 became Ladder 108.

SI companies were originally numbered in the 200s for engines and the 100s for ladders when organized in the early 1900s.  When FDNY reorganized in 1913, SI companies were renumbered, too.  Engines numbers started in the 150s and ladders in the 200s when organized.  In 1913, engines on SI were renumbered starting in the 150s and ladders starting with 76.  SI Engine 201 became Engine 151.  Ladder 201 on SI became Ladder 76.

There were intentional numbering gaps in the sequence between boroughs to enable expansion during the 1913 reorganization.  Most of these gap numbers were never organized as companies. 
 

mack

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Squad numbering is distinctive.  Squads originally were manpower units formed during World War II when engine and truck rosters were depleted. These companies were numbered Squads 21, 22 and 24.  They were disbanded after the war.

When the department needed manpower units in the 50s, 60s and 70s, Squads 1 through 9 were formed, and then disbanded, as needed.

The current squad numbering maintained their original engine company designation when current SOC squads were developed in the 1990s. Squad 1 is the only exception maintaining its original squad number while remaining in service in Brooklyn, the Bronx and Manhattan over the years. 
 

mack

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FDNY fireboat numbering is also unique.  They were originally organized with engine company numbers and renumbered in the 1950s with Marine Company numbers beginning with Marine 1.  Engine 57 (Marine) became Marine 1.
 

mack

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Some engine and ladder companies were double companies - with 2 sections.  Both used the same primary number.  Example - Engine 31-1 and Engine 31-2.

Some engine companies were organized or converted to a Combined Engine Company with both an engine and a ladder section.  These combined companies were normally numbered in sequence like the other engine companies in their borough.  Example - Engine 82 in the Bronx  became Combined Engine Company 82 and then became Engine 82 again.  A few exceptions - some engine and ladder companies were combined for a few years in the 1970s and were renumbered.  Example - Engine 151 and Ladder 76 on SI became Combined Fire Company 131.

The chief posted this great listing of FDNY units:
http://nyfd.com/history/cityhist.pdf
 
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Rescue 1 is not in Engine 2's former quarters.  That was destroyed in a fire and a brand new firehouse was built after that.
 
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johnd248 said:
Rescue 1 is not in Engine 2's former quarters.  That was destroyed in a fire and a brand new firehouse was built after that.
Yes, the building is new, but I believe the locale/address is the same.
 
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  A lot of consolidation has been done mostly after 1944 where some single engines were moved to nearby ladder co. firehouses: E8-L2(1944), E13-L20(1948), E22-L13(1960, before new house was built for both in 1961), E40-L35(1918), E58-L26(1948), E60-L17(1948), E76-L22(1957), E214-L111(1948), E227-L123(1949), E230-L102(1946-1950). Also Ladder 9 moved from 109 Elizabeth St. to Engine 33's big house @Great Jones St. in 1948, L23 from 504 W. 140th St. straight back to E80 @503 W. 139th St., and L103 from 183 Concord St.(nr. Manhattan Br.) to E290 @480 Sheffield Ave.(E. New York).     
 
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