Engine 17 Engine FDNY

Captain784 · Jun 27, 2023

When I was transferred to Tower Ladder 18 in March 1977, Max Rutter was still an active M.P.). = Motor Pump Operator in Engine 17, If am correct he was what was called years ago "1st. Whip" meaning the senior member of the company. Max was easy to talk to even if you were a "Johnie" = newer firemen, and he had a lot of good stories about his many days in Engine 17 and knew the Lower East Side of Manhattan like few others. I wish I could remember when he retired, I most likely was at his retirement party, but that was more than 45 years ago or so. Alot of information was lost when Engine 17 was disbanded in 1991. I am still responding to fires from time to time as Safety Officer in the Chester N.Y. Volunteer Fire.
Dept. I was in Tower Ladder 18 from March 1977 till Oct. 1984 when I was promoted to Lieutenant and assigned to Battalion 26 in the South Bronx. I worked a few tours of overtime as a Captain in TL-18 and E-15 and was Acting Battalion Chief in Battalion 4 a few times. The Lower East Side has changed a lot since Max's time, I only wish someone could have recorded Max's stories and wisdom from his many days in Engine 17.
Captain Bob Rainey FDNY Engine 26 retired

Bazarson · Jun 28, 2023

Captain784 said:
When I was transferred to Tower Ladder 18 in March 1977, Max Rutter was still an active M.P.). = Motor Pump Operator in Engine 17, If am correct he was what was called years ago "1st. Whip" meaning the senior member of the company. Max was easy to talk to even if you were a "Johnie" = newer firemen, and he had a lot of good stories about his many days in Engine 17 and knew the Lower East Side of Manhattan like few others. I wish I could remember when he retired, I most likely was at his retirement party, but that was more than 45 years ago or so. Alot of information was lost when Engine 17 was disbanded in 1991. I am still responding to fires from time to time as Safety Officer in the Chester N.Y. Volunteer Fire.
Dept. I was in Tower Ladder 18 from March 1977 till Oct. 1984 when I was promoted to Lieutenant and assigned to Battalion 26 in the South Bronx. I worked a few tours of overtime as a Captain in TL-18 and E-15 and was Acting Battalion Chief in Battalion 4 a few times. The Lower East Side has changed a lot since Max's time, I only wish someone could have recorded Max's stories and wisdom from his many days in Engine 17.
Captain Bob Rainey FDNY Engine 26 retiredView attachment 36199

Hi Bob, My Father was Max Rutter. He retired about the time you started. I remember him going to visit often, taking the subway, like work from Far Rockaway until we moved to Long island in 1985. His life was his family but the firehouse was his identity . He used to tell us many stories of in general terms. One of the greatest treats of having a Father who was a NYC fire fighter, never a fireman, was coming to the house, to pick him up after a tour of duty & touring the house. The house on Broome Street is most in my memories because of Dad's length of time stationed there. Sliding down the pole with my Father behind us hugging us close to the brass pole for that short quick trip down to the trucks was like any amusement park ride. We went on the trucks, sat in the ladder's seat, rang the bells & when the bells rang for a run we knew to get out of the way quickly. He lived on Delancey Street until he married my Mom, so the Lower Eastside was his neighborhood. Everyone knew him & vice versa. Shopping with him or walking the neighborhood we were stopped with many greetings. A lot of shop keepers, people knew me as Little Maxie. Your praises are a tribute to his dedication & my Cousin sent this testimony to us & I in turn sent it to my siblings. We had my Dad until February 23, 2001 & he is truly missed. His stories of the old days were always spiced with plenty of "not politically correct witticisms". Thank you again on behalf of the Rutter & extended clan for your fine words. David I. Rutter P.S. His gravestone has an engraving in the stone of his badge.

Captain784 · Jul 4, 2023

God bless Max one of the old guard of Engine 17. He was a lot of fun to work with and someone we laughed with, but always respected.
Captain Bob Rainey FDNY Engine 26 retired

Bazarson · Jul 4, 2023

Hi Bob, Your words are quite kind. We never really knew any of the guys Dad worked with, except introductions when we came to the firehouse, we knew some names, but not the faces, but your words are a true testimonial to the job he was dedicated to performing, loved, & we were always proud of his service. Thank you again, David I. Rutter

Rich M · Jul 4, 2023

Gentleman, here you go.

Bazarson · Jul 4, 2023

That's the building I remember most from the 1960's until the move to Pitt St. in 1973, where my father Max Rutter was a chauffeur since circa 1950, who drove the pumper. Riding in the car on the cobblestones, the humming of the tires. I few stores up from the house, maybe the 2nd 1 in view, was a candy distributor & my Dad always took us their & the owner always gave us a Hershey's chocolate bar. Needless to say my Dad wasn't just a Fire Fighter he was also our Candyman! We always had plain & almonds Hershey's along with lots of other treats especially on holidays.

baileyjeff · Jul 5, 2023

Bazarson said:
That's the building I remember most from the 1960's until the move to Pitt St. in 1973, where my father Max Rutter was a chauffeur since circa 1950, who drove the pumper. Riding in the car on the cobblestones, the humming of the tires. I few stores up from the house, maybe the 2nd 1 in view, was a candy distributor & my Dad always took us their & the owner always gave us a Hershey's chocolate bar. Needless to say my Dad wasn't just a Fire Fighter he was also our Candyman! We always had plain & almonds Hershey's along with lots of other treats especially on holidays.

Why was 17 disbanded?

Bazarson · Jul 5, 2023

You would have to ask fire fighters or the FDNY as to why a company is disbanded.

Signal73 · Jul 5, 2023

baileyjeff said:
Why was 17 disbanded?

Go back to Page 1. Think its in the news paper article. Might be in the 2nd paragraph

Looks like Financial reasons

fdhistorian · Jul 5, 2023

baileyjeff said:
Why was 17 disbanded?

January 3, 1991
Engine 17, Engine 294, and Marine 2 were disbanded

Engine 15 moved to Engine 17s location, 10 years later
Engine 294 was re-instated, 3 years later
Marine 1 is now in Marine 2s location, 20 years later

t123ken · Jul 5, 2023

When you think of companies being disbanded, some were very close to each other.
Engines 15 and 17.
Engines 35 and 36.
Engines 82 and 85.

fdhistorian · Jul 5, 2023

t123ken said:
When you think of companies being disbanded, some were very close to each other.
Engines 15 and 17.
Engines 35 and 36.
Engines 82 and 85.

15 & 17 were further apart until a new firehouse was built between them for 17,
35 & 36 were also further apart until a new firehouse was built between them for 35,
82 & 85 started out together in 82s house

t123ken · Jul 5, 2023

fdhistorian said:
15 & 17 were further apart until a new firehouse was built between them for 17,
35 & 36 were also further apart until a new firehouse was built between them for 35,
82 & 85 started out together in 82s house

But they were close when one of them was closed.
Being so close, it makes you wonder how they lasted for as long as they did after the workload decreased from its peak.

kidfrmqns · Jul 6, 2023

t123ken said:
When you think of companies being disbanded, some were very close to each other.
Engines 15 and 17.
Engines 35 and 36.
Engines 82 and 85.

I've always wondered how E328 stayed open but all of these were closed. I suppose it's because there is no one else around them.

fdhistorian · Jul 6, 2023

kidfrmqns said:
I've always wondered how E328 stayed open but all of these were closed. I suppose it's because there is no one else around them.

Firehouse closures are more political than scientific. Communities fight to keep the local firehouse from being closed but oppose new ones (not in my back yard).
Firehouses are positioned for response time/distance.
Companies are deployed for effectiveness in operations and are more easily added or removed as neighborhood demands and conditions change.
264 house has had two engine companies since 1923. It takes time to get enough resources into the area, which is five times larger in area than City Island.

Joe Dolan · Mar 21, 2024

HHis approximate dates of service were between 1868-92. I know this location was disbanded (early 1900's?) Can someone point me in the right direction towards finding and info, docs or pics of this Engine. My ancestor's name was Adam Messer.

t123ken · Mar 22, 2024

Engine 17's former quarters at 91 Ludlow Street:
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.718...y2Q-BHlXzWD0To6Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

https://maps.app.goo.gl/zKNdCiy8Jwixxt4g9

Joe Dolan · Mar 22, 2024

t123ken said:
Engine 17's former quarters at 91 Ludlow Street:
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.718...y2Q-BHlXzWD0To6Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

https://maps.app.goo.gl/zKNdCiy8Jwixxt4g9

Thanks. I 've seen this. I've also noticed that other firehouses of that era have the same design. I was able to find Adam Messer on the 1880 Federal census where it shows him living there with several other firefighters. Some these dates are still tentative, but i believe he arrive in the US from Prussia in 1863. Became a fireman at Engine 17 in 1868. At some time he transferred to E53 further uptown and ultimately passed away in 1892 at 49 years of age. I have other details of his life, but it takes a lot tedious effort.

Rich M · Mar 22, 2024

Here is a shot taken sometime in 1940. They moved in with L18 in 1939 so they were already out of here when this was taken.

FDNY Response Videos · Mar 23, 2024

That 91 ludlow street FH is definitely looking worse for wear nowadays - seems like the current owners aren’t investing much in upkeep

Engine 17 Engine FDNY

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