New FDNY Tillers

grumpy grizzly said:
what is the basis for your comment of 3 confirmed tillers, or maybe 5? And as stated in my post Seagrave had not indicated a time frame for assembly of these units. Now we are going to go from 11 to possibly 16? Many departments have been told there is up to a 2 year lag between placing the order and accepting delivery of the final product.
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5 companys want to go to tillers, 3 have been confirmed to switch over.
 
grumpy grizzly said:
I have a question. If there is the need for additional tillers would those be an add-on to the existing Seagrave order? Or would it required a new bidding process which might bring a new player to the field?
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the bidding process i believe was well over a year ago if not longer. i could be wrong but i believe the tiller bid was awarded right after the rear mount bid
 
Rich@36 said:
the bidding process i believe was well over a year ago if not longer. i could be wrong but i believe the tiller bid was awarded right after the rear mount bid
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l remember reading of it somewhere here but l can't find the thread, l went back 9 pages and so no specific title.
 
There are a lot of factors involved......many of the Walker FH's and others cannot support the additional weight and space is tight in most quarters. Also many response areas have changed with the addition of bike lanes and pedestrian plazas and citybike docks and other various progressive initiatives. It will be interesting to see who gets them. 82 and 83 in SI should have but quarters may not support them.
 
The only reason I can see L169 having a Tiller is that they are a Rescue Support Truck. Tillers have more room to carry supplies but would it mean all Support Trucks would be switched! I don’t think so.
Brighton has some narrow streets but from first hand knowledge there was never a problem negotiating the streets.
Let’s see what develops but something to talk about🤔
 
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Does anyone know what companies want to go to Tillers who have been approved? I remember growing up L-151 had a Tiller for years.
 
Rich@36 said:
tell seagraves what? the tiller order? we've known about this for awhile now. the added tillers, we've also known about. See
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9pm
Rich@36 said:
tell seagraves what? the tiller order? we've known about this for awhile now. the added tillers, we've also known about.
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Rich@36....You see what I've told you in the past. Everything is speculation that's being said but yet they have the right to ask. Nobody actually knows..... It's just as requested by FDNY NOT TO GIVE ANY INFO OUT. From what l read there will be approx 4 fire trucks that bend. And as stated there will be some sticks going to fire trucks that bend. DON'T EXPECT THEM IN THE NEAR FUTURE.
 
GeoC said:
The only reason I can see L169 having a Tiller is that they are a Rescue Support Truck. Tillers have more room to carry supplies but would it mean all Support Trucks would be switched! I don’t think so.
Brighton has some narrow streets but from first hand knowledge there was never a problem negotiating the streets.
Let’s see what develops but something to talk about🤔
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I have always been partial to Tillers in general but I have said in the past after the SSLs were formed that they should all be Tillers since as you say "more room for equipment" & also the ability to negotiate streets anywhere in NYC since in their SSL capacity they might be assigned to various areas all around NYC.....the Compartment layout & maneuverability cannot be said about shorter type Ladder Rigs.
 
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fdny747 said:
Does anyone know what companies want to go to Tillers who have been approved? I remember growing up L-151 had a Tiller for years.
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Going way, way back ALL FDNY Ladder Companies were Tiller Rigs thru the years then the 2 High Ladders & then the 1st TL in 1964 then Rearmount Aerials starting with one in1969 & more following from 1970 on & the number of Tillers dwindled for a few reasons .....you mentioned LAD*151 ....they were in an adjoining BN to mine but I had them on several of my Boxes & they certainly should have kept a Tiller for a good part of their 1st Due area South of their FH but at one point the Job said they are getting a RM ......the CPT at the time went to the Community Board & lobbied to keep the Tiller .....when the Community Board Officers called HQ & brought it up the CPT immediately got a nasty gram from HQ telling him to stop lobbying & take the RM or he would become a Covering CPT elsewhere.......this was the case thru the years in several LADs that fought to keep their Tiller.....I guess in 2023 some more logical heads are making the decisions.
 
There were also few unpopular Quads in service in the 1950s when tillers were assigned to all other ladder companies.

L 76 1951 WLF Quad.jpg


The concern about apparatus floor weight bearing capability must be an engineering challenge. How do you evaluate and then continue to evaluate floors for if weight is a valid safety concern. Do you just reinforce every apparatus floor? Most FDNY firehouses are 100 years old, or nearing that age, to include all the Walker firehouses. Many were built for smaller and lighter horse-pulled rigs - both engine and truck. Can you accurately project future years' structural wear and tear on floors? Will firehouses need apparatus ratings for weight bearing and size limitations which will affect apparatus assignment and relocations?
 
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WNYF 1969 - Purchase of 16 tillers and 23 rearmounts (also 80 Mack pumpers, 6 tower ladders and 3 rescues) - all served through the War Years.

Rearmounts.gif
 
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Which is the most recent company to lose their tiller? 173? Do any of our members have any knowledge of the history of that decision?
 
Concerning the weight factor between the tillers and tower ladders. When Ladder 44 received their TL in the 60's, it was only then the floor was reinforced with rows of screw jacks in the basement.
 
FDNYSTATENISLAND said:
As mentioned, L83 could really use one and L82 even can make a slight case with the blocks behind their quarters. I can see L169 with the Brighton numbered streets.
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If I'm not mistaken L82 had an ALF tiller in the '70s. Yes those blocks are tight back there.
 
Living in Harlem back is in the 70's Ladders 26 and 28th switched from tillers to rear mounts. Ladder 25 did the same. Interestingly Ladder 21 went from a rear mount to a TL
 
Years ago when it was first determined that some floors might not support some Rigs an idea that was considered at the time was to possibly fill the cellar underneath with wet concrete......this was never done & the multiple screw jacks in the cellar became the immediate solution followed in many cases with a complete floor removal followed with a stronger replacement......i remember one early "low bidder" getting the job at a FH & having their workers start hand jack hammering the floor then trying to carry the portion done out of the cellar by hoisting pieces up in 5 gallon buckets.....after a few days they walked away from the job leaving a big hole.....subsequent more capable contractors used mechanical equipment. ......the hand jack hammering reminds me of another contractor who got the job to re do a FH bathroom & instead of using penny tiles in a sheet he had one worker with buckets of individual penny tiles placing them one at a time.
 
What other ladder companies would need or want a Tiller other than the companies that already have them? I know L151 could use one again I think.
 
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