Charts - Growing Impact of FDNY CFR Runs on Engine Companies

[Capttomo]

Data obtained from Frank Raffa at FDNY.com

In reviewing the annual runs data, it's interesting to examine how the FDNY CFR (Certified First Responder) runs are adding to the FDNY workload. For those not familiar, the FDNY CFR runs are where an engine company is dispatched to a critical call for EMS so that they can arrive on scene faster than EMS to begin initiating aid prior to the arrival of an FDNY civilian staffed EMS BLS or ALS transport unit. The engine company cannot abandon the patient until the ambulance arrives, which can at times, be quite the wait. The FDNY CFR program was initiated in mid 1996, so statistically the first year is incomplete data when examining annual runs. Looking at the charts below, we can clearly see that FDNY engine companies are trending more and more CFR runs each year. From 1997 until 2022, The total number of FDNY CFR runs increased by 118%. Looking at the statistics and chart for the busiest CRF Engine Company, in 1997 the engine company that ran the most CFR runs, responded to 1728 medical runs...by 2022 the engine company that responded to the most CFR runs, ran 3960, and in 2019 the engine company with the most CFR runs responded to 4098, a whopping 137% increase. Some of the units seeing the most fire duty, e.g. E290 and E75 are also among the companies running more than 2000 CFR runs a year. How many times has a first due engine for an actual structural fire been delayed or off the ticket because they were on an EMS run......while an Engine like E75 is surrounded by neighboring Engines in close proximity, E290 has a huge first due response area, and due to geography, has no units coming from the south, meaning that in some cases it is a long run for a second due company like 225 or 257 to get into some of 290's first due areas. Just an observation for discussion. On another note, FDNY Engine 1, by Madison Square Garden, in recent years has placed in the top 10 Engines for total runs. A further look reveals that in 2022, FDNY E1 ran a total of 6027 runs of which 3514 were CFR (EMS) runs. Thats a jaw dropping 58.3% of all their runs are for CFR.

 

[tem217]

another reason to support the need for 5 man engines.

 

[Capttomo]

another reason to support the need for 5 man engines.

absolutely

 

[grumpy grizzly]

Data obtained from Frank Raffa at FDNY.com

In reviewing the annual runs data, it's interesting to examine how the FDNY CFR (Certified First Responder) runs are adding to the FDNY workload. For those not familiar, the FDNY CFR runs are where an engine company is dispatched to a critical call for EMS so that they can arrive on scene faster than EMS to begin initiating aid prior to the arrival of an FDNY civilian staffed EMS BLS or ALS transport unit. The engine company cannot abandon the patient until the ambulance arrives, which can at times, be quite the wait. The FDNY CFR program was initiated in mid 1996, so statistically the first year is incomplete data when examining annual runs. Looking at the charts below, we can clearly see that FDNY engine companies are trending more and more CFR runs each year. From 1997 until 2022, The total number of FDNY CFR runs increased by 118%. Looking at the statistics and chart for the busiest CRF Engine Company, in 1997 the engine company that ran the most CFR runs, responded to 1728 medical runs...by 2022 the engine company that responded to the most CFR runs, ran 3960, and in 2019 the engine company with the most CFR runs responded to 4098, a whopping 137% increase. Some of the units seeing the most fire duty, e.g. E290 and E75 are also among the companies running more than 2000 CFR runs a year. How many times has a first due engine for an actual structural fire been delayed or off the ticket because they were on an EMS run......while an Engine like E75 is surrounded by neighboring Engines in close proximity, E290 has a huge first due response area, and due to geography, has no units coming from the south, meaning that in some cases it is a long run for a second due company like 225 or 257 to get into some of 290's first due areas. Just an observation for discussion. On another note, FDNY Engine 1, by Madison Square Garden, in recent years has placed in the top 10 Engines for total runs. A further look reveals that in 2022, FDNY E1 ran a total of 6027 runs of which 3514 were CFR (EMS) runs. Thats a jaw dropping 58.3% of all their runs are for CFR.

View attachment 34234

View attachment 34235

This situation is not unique to FDNY. Two other departments that I monitor via the web are Boston and Chicago. I cannot get a breakdown as to what % are EMS or fire for either department so I have to go by total runs. On Chicago's West Side in the Garfield Park area is E95/T-26/A10. Last years total runs per company were E-95 5065, 4th, T-26 5410, first, and A-10 8834. 95/26's total were 10,475 and you know damn well most of them are EMS calls, I don't think there are that many buildings in their still area? Most of these runs are for minor reasons, or just outright refusals for service. Boston alternates its runs between engines and ladders but Ladder 4 had 5207. There is a lot of abuse in the EMS programs but after all these years it just seems to be the way it is and the way it will be.

 

[scoobyd]

Interesting data. Are people getting that much sicker? From 2010, the runs climb steadily, not coming down except for the Covid anomaly.
Or has the triage/response matrix been "adjusted"?

Practical effects for the troops- endless CFR runs, where in 99.5% of the cases, you cannot provide any meaningful medical intervention. All day, all nite. When motivated and high caliber people continually perform work without meaning, it grinds down morale.

Big chiefs now routinely send Jr. to a truck from PFS. Officers will cover for years to get a truck assignment. Talented FFs transfer out of the engine at the earliest opportunity. Who can blame them?

 

[lfdlt31]

Interesting data. But for sure not unique to FDNY. On my department in Alberta Canada we added a pump (engine) to our downtown station because pump 1 was doing 5000 runs a year. Last year Pump 1 and Pump1A both did over 5000

 

[entropychaser]

Data obtained from Frank Raffa at FDNY.com

In reviewing the annual runs data, it's interesting to examine how the FDNY CFR (Certified First Responder) runs are adding to the FDNY workload. For those not familiar, the FDNY CFR runs are where an engine company is dispatched to a critical call for EMS so that they can arrive on scene faster than EMS to begin initiating aid prior to the arrival of an FDNY civilian staffed EMS BLS or ALS transport unit. The engine company cannot abandon the patient until the ambulance arrives, which can at times, be quite the wait. The FDNY CFR program was initiated in mid 1996, so statistically the first year is incomplete data when examining annual runs. Looking at the charts below, we can clearly see that FDNY engine companies are trending more and more CFR runs each year. From 1997 until 2022, The total number of FDNY CFR runs increased by 118%. Looking at the statistics and chart for the busiest CRF Engine Company, in 1997 the engine company that ran the most CFR runs, responded to 1728 medical runs...by 2022 the engine company that responded to the most CFR runs, ran 3960, and in 2019 the engine company with the most CFR runs responded to 4098, a whopping 137% increase. Some of the units seeing the most fire duty, e.g. E290 and E75 are also among the companies running more than 2000 CFR runs a year. How many times has a first due engine for an actual structural fire been delayed or off the ticket because they were on an EMS run......while an Engine like E75 is surrounded by neighboring Engines in close proximity, E290 has a huge first due response area, and due to geography, has no units coming from the south, meaning that in some cases it is a long run for a second due company like 225 or 257 to get into some of 290's first due areas. Just an observation for discussion. On another note, FDNY Engine 1, by Madison Square Garden, in recent years has placed in the top 10 Engines for total runs. A further look reveals that in 2022, FDNY E1 ran a total of 6027 runs of which 3514 were CFR (EMS) runs. Thats a jaw dropping 58.3% of all their runs are for CFR.

View attachment 34234

View attachment 34235

In 2022, one engine EMS response for every 24 residents.

 

[Lebby]

It is important to point out that FDNY CFR only responds on what are reported as serious incidents which only make up a small portions of total EMS assignments in the city. Many departments send companies in even the most minor of EMS assignments tying them up for more serious fires and emergencies.

 

[entropychaser]

They need to start breaking down engine EMS responses by category:

CPR
Administer oxygen
Stop bleeding
Administer Narcan
Calm down relatives
Move 350 pounds down stairs
Wake up street "sleepers"

 

[Bulldog]

another reason to support the need for 5 man engines.

Actually, I think it is a reason to support more engine companies instead of additional meeting on the existing companies. If you had manpower you are just tying up more people for a scene that in most cases doesn't Req that much manpower. By adding additional companies he would have more available resources to respond.

 

[Bulldog]

They need to start breaking down engine EMS responses by category:

CPR
Administer oxygen
Stop bleeding
Administer Narcan
Calm down relatives
Move 350 pounds down stairs
Wake up street "sleepers"

You actually forget the category of "looking for a ride"!

 

[tommyhal&oat]

Actually, I think it is a reason to support more engine companies instead of additional meeting on the existing companies. If you had manpower you are just tying up more people for a scene that in most cases doesn't Req that much manpower. By adding additional companies he would have more available resources to respond.

In my opinion, I don't think its more engine companies that are needed but more ambulances and EMS personnel. This would help with the problem that often occurs now, where the engines are tied up for a bit waiting for a bus. Especially in this day and age where fires are decreasing and EMS runs are increasing, don't know how much adding more companies would help.

 

[grumpy grizzly]

It is important to point out that FDNY CFR only responds on what are reported as serious incidents which only make up a small portions of total EMS assignments in the city. Many departments send companies in even the most minor of EMS assignments tying them up for more serious fires and emergencies.

Boston's drug problems seems to be concentrated in a section of Roxbury/Dorchester nicknamed "The Methadone Mile" give or take its length. Ironically, or sadly depending on your point of view it includes Boston FD Headquarters. This area is in Engine 21's still area. Because they were doing so many drug overdose cases a special unit, Delta 43 was organized by Boston EMS to alleviate the workload. Well last year Engine 21 was busiest with 4200 runs! And they still have to deal with the OD problem because D-43 is tied up somewhere else!

 

[Lebby]

Our engines don't go on drugs and more often than not they don't have prolonged wait times for EMS except in very rare occasions

 

[Extra One & One]

Our engines don't go on drugs and more often than not they don't have prolonged wait times for EMS except in very rare occasions

Lebby, do you mean the engines don’t respond to drug overdoses, or the engines don’t respond if they’ve been doing drugs? 🤣🤣🤣

 

[JohnnyGage]

Our engines don't go on drugs and more often than not they don't have prolonged wait times for EMS except in very rare occasions

Lebby this is in your wheelhouse, what do you suggest? I would think it be more productive to implement fly cars (think: strike team) with 2 EMS personnel during high activity hours in targeted areas.

 

[airbusboeing]

i think they have one the tactical response group in the Bronx and in queens

 

[airbusboeing]

Our engines don't go on drugs and more often than not they don't have prolonged wait times for EMS except in very rare occasions

isn't also often to get 10-91. and isn't very rare to have 10-99 cpr in progress with ems not on scene

 

[Capttomo]

Great discussion and input by many including some insight on similar operations in other large Northeastern departments. First I just want to emphasize that this in no way is critical of the men and women of FDNY EMS. They do a stellar job, are underpaid and understaffed. Yes there are many many fire departments running first responder and many running not only a firefighter based and staffed EMS system but ALS engines and Ladders. Most of those departments are based in the south and the west where building construction is more fire resistive and lacking the H type apartment buildings found all over NYC. With the exception of Cities like Boston, Chicago, Detroit, Baltimore, Camden NJ etc. very few are doing the fire duty that many FDNY companies are doing. E290 and E75 are examples of companies with over 500 OSW’s a year. So this thread highlights an operational issue that is experienced by other localities - but as we have heard and said before. NYC is unique in population density, traffic, geography, number of high rises, and number of non fireproof 5 and 6 story non fireproof buildings lacking standpipes and smoke stairwells. This is the kitchen table talk we thrive on. 😉. Great to discuss but none of us here will be able to solve the problems. Great stuff. Stay well

 

[airbusboeing]

what place has staffing levels per unit like fdny, with engines at least 5 members some have 6 and truck companys with 6 members