M
mmattyphoto
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you all forgot about E50,E50-2,L19 and the 6 Div. and later E46,E46-2,L27,L27-2 and Bat56.
My younger Buff years
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nfd2004 said:
La Casa Caca is Eng 73
Thanks "Matty" but there might be even a few more. Unless they were temporary Second Sections using relocated companies, I can remember quite a few more. Eng 91, 88, 233, Lad 26. I"m just not sure if they were permanet second sections. I think in "War Years Trivia" in History, they talk about it.
And Thanks "ChiefBlackCloud", yes, now I remember it as being Engine 73.
And Thanks "ChiefBlackCloud", yes, now I remember it as being Engine 73.
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Wasn't L27-2 at the old firehouse on 176th st. while L27-1 was at the new 460 Cross Bx. Expwy. house?mmattyphoto said:
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E91 was in a large 3 bay/3 story house while E58/L26 were in a much smaller building. Also "La Casa Caca" means "Feces House" which is not a nice slogan.nfd2004 said:
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ISN'T THIS A 'FAMILY' WEBSITE, OR ISN'T IT? ;Draybrag said:Oh, Thomas, me bucko, it couldn't possibly mean "s**t house", now, could it? ??? ??? Or could you just be trying to shield folks' sensitive eyes :??? :
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"La Casa Caca" is Engine 73 / Ladder 42
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QUEENS1985 said:
Just E 73
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Yes these are two separate buildings for E73 & L42, 655 and 661 Prospect Ave., one built in 1900 and the other in 1913.chiefblackcloud said:
I want to add some small pieces of information about chiefs in the War Years . The department instituted DRBs - "Discretionary Response Boxs" in the early 70's (as I recall) to offer some relief to the overstretched battalions. This enabled the responding battalion on these designated boxes to respond with the first due engines/truck or remain in service wherever they were at when the box came in. This let them miss the predictable 10-92's and wait until a preliminary report came in if a job.
There were several battalions that operated with two sections during this period. There was 12-2, 14-2, 37-2, 44-2 and maybe a few others. There was a battalion, I think Bn 60, in the early 70's that rotated into busy battalions to reduce the workload. And still there were many times that dispatchers asked for "any available battalion chief" to take in a working fire. I remember a long run or two from Coney Island into Flatbush as the closest available chief to cover a working taxpayer fire.
I also witnessed a few nights when units working at a job in abandoned buildings (there were a few back then), discovered another building torched across the street or down the block, and operated at both fires during the same run. One example was on Mermaid Ave in Coney Island - a fire in the upper vacant floors, knocked down; the officer from L166 reporting he could see a job across the empty lot a block away; E245/E318/L166/L161 and maybe E253 actually running across the lot while the chauffers drove the rigs around the block; a line and the tower ladder opening up into the vacant building; the aide discovering a third job down the block - and all 3 fires handled by the same awesome companies with one chief (no all hands chief/no safety chief/no rescue bn chief/no deputy). By they way, there were a few more workers that night and this was not the So Bronx, Brownsville, Harlem or Alphabet City, which had nights like this routinely.
Battalion chiefs sometimes ignored transmitting the all hands so they could take the job by themselves and because they knew they were not going to get any additional units. Many jobs back then received a "10-30" on arrival and were fought with 2 & 2, as long as a tower ladder responded.
The BCs picked up resusitator special calls because most line units did not have any medical equipment. I remember runs where the chief and driver were the only FDNY units responding on cardiac and difficulty breathing emergencies. If you rode with a battalion, you went from run to run and frequently did not see quarters from 1500 to midnight.
The battalions transported injured members to the hospital because no one could predict arrival time of an ambulance. FDNY ownership of NYC EMS was still many years away.
Finally frustration - I remember more than once seeing a chief stand in front of a fully involved building waiting for distant engines and trucks to respond in. Aides were frequently the first one in a building because no one else was there.
There were several battalions that operated with two sections during this period. There was 12-2, 14-2, 37-2, 44-2 and maybe a few others. There was a battalion, I think Bn 60, in the early 70's that rotated into busy battalions to reduce the workload. And still there were many times that dispatchers asked for "any available battalion chief" to take in a working fire. I remember a long run or two from Coney Island into Flatbush as the closest available chief to cover a working taxpayer fire.
I also witnessed a few nights when units working at a job in abandoned buildings (there were a few back then), discovered another building torched across the street or down the block, and operated at both fires during the same run. One example was on Mermaid Ave in Coney Island - a fire in the upper vacant floors, knocked down; the officer from L166 reporting he could see a job across the empty lot a block away; E245/E318/L166/L161 and maybe E253 actually running across the lot while the chauffers drove the rigs around the block; a line and the tower ladder opening up into the vacant building; the aide discovering a third job down the block - and all 3 fires handled by the same awesome companies with one chief (no all hands chief/no safety chief/no rescue bn chief/no deputy). By they way, there were a few more workers that night and this was not the So Bronx, Brownsville, Harlem or Alphabet City, which had nights like this routinely.
Battalion chiefs sometimes ignored transmitting the all hands so they could take the job by themselves and because they knew they were not going to get any additional units. Many jobs back then received a "10-30" on arrival and were fought with 2 & 2, as long as a tower ladder responded.
The BCs picked up resusitator special calls because most line units did not have any medical equipment. I remember runs where the chief and driver were the only FDNY units responding on cardiac and difficulty breathing emergencies. If you rode with a battalion, you went from run to run and frequently did not see quarters from 1500 to midnight.
The battalions transported injured members to the hospital because no one could predict arrival time of an ambulance. FDNY ownership of NYC EMS was still many years away.
Finally frustration - I remember more than once seeing a chief stand in front of a fully involved building waiting for distant engines and trucks to respond in. Aides were frequently the first one in a building because no one else was there.
Mack, yes I remember the DRBs. I never saw more than two building fires on the same street though, BUT, I do remember seeing two jobs on the same street and going to an adjoining roof top to check out the trench cuts etc, seeing the building on fire down the street, and then seeing another column of smoke off in the not too far distance. The guy that told me "if it wasn"t for the Tower ladders we might have lost the entire Bronx" was absolutely right. And you"re correct. Most of my stories is from the busiest area"s because that"s where most of us Buffs hung out. But other parts were burning too. I"d hear jobs all over and wouldn"t even give them a second thought. We used to keep a pad and pencil and write down the boxes as they were put out. It was impossible to keep track of everything. I had a box location book, and when a 10-30 or a 10-75 was given, we"d have to look up the location to find out where it was. One of the buffs with me would be doing this and we"d call him our "Field Comm coordinator". (my brother georged4997 must remember that because we usually assigned him the job). As I read these stories and I write what I remember, I wonder "how did these guys ever do it" ? Sometimes I think, well maybe this really wasn"t that bad, and maybe I"m just blowing this out of proportion. But it did happen, and there are others to back up these and similar stories. For me, I enjoy telling these stories. its been my hobby buffing the FDNY for years. And I enjoy reading "Your" Stories. But I hope with all this, those who weren"t around to see this will get a feeling of what these Firefighters did every day and night for 10 - 15 years straight.
M
mmattyphoto
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On those 2nd sections in the Bronx E50-2 moved on to become E46-2. When the worked moved E46-2 became E88-2. L27-2 was on 176 st for a short time until they became L58 and moved into a new house next to E45.regarding B56, if not mistaken they were B18-2.hope I have this right it's been a long time.
Almost Matty. 46-2 was formed in 1968, moved over and became 88-2 in 1969 to allow room for 27-2 to be organized on 176th St with E46. E50-2 wasn't organized until 1970. When 46 and 27 moved to their present quarters in 1972, 27-2 was disbanded and reorganized as L58, awaiting the move to their new quarters next to E45. Squad 1 moved up from Manhattan to 176th Street with L58, and the 56th Battalion was organized and went in there with them.
People forget that by the early 70's the arson hotbed had moved north to the Tremont/Monterrey section. Most of the borough south had been burned out.
People forget that by the early 70's the arson hotbed had moved north to the Tremont/Monterrey section. Most of the borough south had been burned out.
Thanks "Matty" for your help. It all makes sense now. That"s why I remember hearing 88 with two sections, and 46, and 50 with two sections. But it wasn"t throughout the entire War Years when all these second sections operated. And I remember when the fire activity was heading North almost up to Fordham Rd. I said to a buddy of mine, "Look its spreading even up to here". I think we were at a job somewhere around 180 or 182 St maybe Prospect Ave area. That was a pretty far distance from the farther South area where we were chasing jobs. Like G-mans old neighborhood around 60/17, 83/29. As the years went on, you could drive and start to see burned out buildings in every block. Some blocks were completely burned out. As a buff, you"d ride by hundreds of burned out buildings, and never give much thought to it, unless it was a newer job that they caught while you were safe in your suburban home. If anybody had gotten lost, or took a wrong turn while driving to Grandma"s house, I have a feeling they got the "shock of their lives".
Got a little carried away from what "Matty" was referring to, but that brain started to rattle a little. Thanks Matty for your thoughts and clearing us up on some of the Second Sections. And looks like whoever said Ladder 27-2 was right about them being in the old firehouse on 176 St.
Got a little carried away from what "Matty" was referring to, but that brain started to rattle a little. Thanks Matty for your thoughts and clearing us up on some of the Second Sections. And looks like whoever said Ladder 27-2 was right about them being in the old firehouse on 176 St.
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By working 34 yrs. in the Bronx for the U.S. Pistol Service, I was able to see how much of the Southwest Bronx was burned away by the loss of letter carrier routes in the 'War ones". Yes, as people moved away and people with smaller incomes and lesser educated moved into some neighborhoods we at the post office had to re-align letter carrier routes. For instance, the branch I ended my carrer at, Hub located at St. Anns & Westchester once had 30 routes in 1970 and when I retired in 2004 they were down to 12 routes, the same for Mott Haven at 139th & Brook. My first assignment was Blvd. Station on So. Blvd near 167th St. not far from E82/E85/L31 that covered all the way down to Hunts Pt. (94/48). the station had 36 carrier routes in 1970 but by 1981 the same station was cut down to 21 routes because of all the burnt out blocks of vacant lots. Another station, Morrisania at 167th & Washington nr. E50/L19 which had 42 routes in 1970 was reduced to less than 30. Tremont Sta. nr. E46/L27 that covers from E42 all the way across to E88/L38 had 43 routes and was reduced to 30. At most of these So. Bx. post offices there was a special window for broken mailboxes and burnt out buildings where people would line up to pick up there mail because someone broke into there mailbox or their building had a fire. I didn't spend my whole career in the So. Bx. as I also got to work in nice neighborhoods of that time like Baychester, Bedford Pk., Kingsbridge, Parkchester, Wakefield, Williamsbridge, Woodlawn and even had a stint as acting postmaster of City Island in 1973. In the 1980's I was promoted to a position at the main post office at 149th & Grand Conc. My office was in the NE corner of the penthouse area with a panoramic view of the Bronx. I was able to have my scanner at my desk and most of the time I could see the smoke from my windows of most major jobs. One building multiple H type complex at 500 So. Blvd & 147th was the site of a few multiples and I can't believe that those buildings are still standing and occupied today.
I agree with "3511", Great story G-man. I worked as a letter Carrier myself from 1970 - 1975, and I never gave it a thought about people getting their mail after all these burnouts. You certainly made a very good point of how many mail routes were lost in those days, basically all because of the fires. With so many people gone in some of these neighborhoods, and not just the South Bronx. Its easy to understand why other business"s in the area failed, such as food stores, auto repair etc. With nobody left in the neighborhood, those buildings became vacant and then they burned too. I think to really get a grip on what it was like, you really had to be there to see this.
These conditions did also spread to other cities too. But maybe their War Years peaked about 10 years later. I remember in Bridgeport, Ct where they had there own share of War Years. Engine 2 was pumping to two separate fires. One was an vacant theatre, and the other around the corner, a vacant school.
Then don"t forget the huge rubbish fires where they used stangs or deck guns to extinguish these fires. Or then the cars that were set on fire, many of which were stolen and which were good places to drop them off. Unless there was some dead animal, maybe a cat or dog, or maybe the rats, the oder of smoke just never left the area.
These conditions did also spread to other cities too. But maybe their War Years peaked about 10 years later. I remember in Bridgeport, Ct where they had there own share of War Years. Engine 2 was pumping to two separate fires. One was an vacant theatre, and the other around the corner, a vacant school.
Then don"t forget the huge rubbish fires where they used stangs or deck guns to extinguish these fires. Or then the cars that were set on fire, many of which were stolen and which were good places to drop them off. Unless there was some dead animal, maybe a cat or dog, or maybe the rats, the oder of smoke just never left the area.
M
mmattyphoto
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Thanks for the help 3511. Killed to many brain cells over the years.